Marcel Burkett

I'v finally made up my mind , after looking at the DTA Fast , AEM and Autronic ECM's , the Autronic has emerged the winner . I will be purcjasing one soon , i plan to set it up using a MSD DIS 2 and a pair of E6A's , anyone have any wiring diagrams and install info , all help will be appreciated !!.

AnthonyNYC

iTrader: (3)

PM Enzo250, you can purchase through him since he's a dealer and runs the unit in his car as well, very knowledgeable on the product.

Anthony

Marcel Burkett

I did send him a pm , but got no reply.

AnthonyNYC

iTrader: (3)

He's probably still typing since he loves Autronic so much

Do a search on some of his older posts in the meantime, I'm sure you will find a lot of info as well.

Anthony

SnowmanSteiner

I like your choice Marcell, I'll be going with Autronic as well. Let me know what information you can find out about it, as I don't know of any dealers in the US or pricing. Good luck!!

- Steiner

enzo250

I'm a NY Dealer for Autronic...

I'm also the one who helped develop rotary applications with the SM2/SM4 here in the US.
Rice Racing is also an Autronic pioneer and has been using autronic for quite some time.

sk8world

iTrader: (5)

Prices on the Autronic? Is it comparible to the PFC once you add the commander, datalogic, and wideband?

Marcel Burkett

The power FC is a joke comparde to it. My local dealer is trying to convince me to not use all six injectors (2x550 $ 4X1600) in my setup , he is telling me to just use one pair of the 16's with the 550 primaries , I am wondering why ? . Is there a problem using 6 injectors and having them staged ??.

enzo250

With the autronic you could run 16 1600cc injectors if you really wanted to so there's no problem there.

with rotary's they really like small amounts of fuel to idle and large amounts under boost. Hence the reason mazda run's staged.

So if you want to run the 2 -550s as primarys and 4 1600's staged you'll have no problems.
The only thing you'll need to work on is getting a nice smooth transition between having 2 550's running and then all of suddening adding 4 1600's.

They way staging works with the autronic is you can shut off any injector you want and when they turn on it's not progressive. They just turn on.
You can adjust them thru the injector trim maps. Using 4 of the same size injectors is easier to get a smooth transition but this doesn't mean you can't do it with different size injectors. You'll just have to be a bit more creative.

BTW. What kind of HP are you expecting to make?

sk8world

iTrader: (5)

Sorry, my questions was not was it as good or better but price wise? How much more are we talking? Seems the price has always been hush.hush!

Marcel Burkett

Funny , my dealer tells me that the staging in the Autronic works opposite to what you discribed , un-like the Haltech staging method (what you discribed) of , "off / on" staging , the Autronic staging is an "always on" type , where the secondaries are pulsed along with the primaries but to a very small degree , the voltage to the injectors is increased gradually until they are brought fully on line when required ?? , is this so , ?? , he even showed me a little staging table where I saw the voltage increasing up to 1.0 I(I guess this is then multiplied by 10 ) against load , so which is it ? , can you clear this up for me ?.
As for power I am expecting over 550bhp , I wouldnt be surprised if I go over 600 !!.

enzo250

Huh? Injectors are always supplied 12v. They are pulsed thru the ECU with ground.
How can voltage vary?

The 1.49 chip and now the new 1.99 chip are the only autronic models that have staged inj.
Autronic doesn't believe in staged injection because their injector control is good and there's no need to run staged since they can control very large injectors without issues.
They only added that feature to support the rotary engine.

The way it works and is setup is thru the inj trim tables of each inj used.
Now each inj has it's own trim table. In the trim table you set when the staging will take place with rpm/load points. So lets say 3000 rpm and 1 psi boost. The staged injectors are turned off unless those parameters are met. Now above 3000 rpms and 1psi they will turn on. They are not progressive when they come on.

enzo250

On the fuel map (haltech) there's a point that show's when the staging takes place.

On the autronic fuel map it's based on rpm/load and there's no indication of where the staging takes place. It's setup thru the injector trim tables...
Maybe this is what your dealer was trying to say??

luiml73

iTrader: (1)

Just use the Autotune feature. I think you need a very expensive sensor though

The Autotune ™ software is much faster then a good
operator. It is not possible to manually tune as quick
as the Autotune ™. A typical engine will take less than
20 minutes to fully map on an engine dyno.
The accuracy of the Autotune ™ can be setup in the
software from 0.5% to 5.0% accuracy. The default value
is 2% accuracy, this is generally a lot more accuracy
then most tuners manual tune engines

Autronic Autotune ™ software provides rapid hands-tree
tuning of Engine Air/Fuel mixtures. This automated operation
frees the engine tuner, allowing total concentration
on safe engine/dyno operation. On road tuning of motor
vehicles is even possible.
This software uses a complex combination of math, including
statistics, trigonometry and fuzzy logic to intelligently
adjust the fuel delivery tables. Initial tuning is rapid
usually occurring within 1 second. High precision can
be achieved by allowing the Autotune ™ to operate for
an extended time at each engine operating point. The
operator has control over the balance between tuning
speed and accuracy. Accuracy is ultimately limited by
the accuracy of the attached Air/Fuel ratio measurement
equipment.
The program provides visual indication of the tune
status. Automatic and manual storage of tune status
allows the user to monitor the tuning progress even
if undertaken in several sessions. Tuning usually proceeds
2 to 5 times faster than possible by manual means. Fuel
savings of as much at 90% have been reported. The considerable
savings in engine life are obvious.
This program also has elaborate diagnostics facilities
and allows simultaneous operation of the ECU internal
data logger and external P.C data logging.
Versions are now available that have live engine operating
data graphs while tuning, and a live 3D graphical presentation
of the tuning process

Marcel Burkett

Maybe that explains why I cant' find the "staging " table .When I go to the fuel trim tables the map is set up with RPM against load and the injector trim value is in % from 61.7 to 161.3 (0-100%) , so cant I adjust how much the injector pulses ? , if I change the value at say , 6500rpm and 200Kpa to what ever 100% , would this mean that the injector will come on at 38% dc ?? (100-61.7)

enzo250

ok..

So in the injector trim table if you enter a value of 61.7 this will turn off the injector. Anything above this and the injector will turn on and operate at that percentage. so if you enter a value of 75 then the inj will be at flowing 75 % of it's flow...

RICE RACING

INNOVATE MOTORSPORTS LM-1 & **THEIR** AUTRONIC AUTOTUNE CABLE is all you need, does a better job than anything else I have used

I have set up 3 different Autronic ECU's with my LM-1 in auto tune mode and all I can say is it works without fault and gives all status windows during the process........... very cheap , very fast, very accurate

enzo250

Hey peter... What's new

Dude i can barely read what you wrote. Could you use a bigger font? hehe...

RICE RACING

Whats new? My POS will be ready in a few weeks time I tried e-mailing you but no responce?

I'll make sure I use a larger font next time.........

TomSwift

Hey I'm new to the site but I have an 85 GSL-SE and an SM2 already (but it's not in the car yet). I was wondering if any of the stock sensors work with the SM2 and if not what ones are needed to get it to work correctly. How much does it cost to update the chip in my SM2 to the 1.99?

Also where is a link for the LM-1 and what cable is theirs is it autronics or innovate motor sports?

BTW don't most O2 sensors melt with the temps that are coming out of the rotory engine or is there a special one that is needed?

Thanks
Jonathan

TomSwift

Oh I forgot to ask one other question, the SM2 doesn't come with a knock sensor what are you guys using to get around this and what do you think of the J&S safeguard?

Marcel Burkett

since 61.7= o % or off , then 75% would be 75 + 61.7 = 136.7 right ??, and in your opinion , what would be the best and simplest way to use six injectors in a staged configuration ? , should I just run two injectors on each secondary driver ? or is there another way to do it that will allow me to run like a 3 staged system. Do you think its better to run same sized primary and secondary injectors ? .

enzo250

it's easier to setup the transition with 4 of the same size injectors.
4 - 96lb should suit most applications otherwise use 4 -160lbs if your really pushing big hp..

You can still do it with different size doesn't matter. If you want to run 6 i would run 2 primary and 4 secondarys(2per driver).

Pm me or email for more info otherwise we'll just be posting back and forth for ever...

TomSwift

So nobody wants to comment about the new guys questions

Marcel Burkett

Tom , in my user manual it stated that the IAT sensor as Autronics design and it SHOULD NOT be changed !! , as for the coolant temperature sensor , substitute ones can be used if they are of a certain spec (can't remember , but it's in the book) . You would have to use the ECM's map sensor , simply because ther isn't a way to use another (external) one .I dont know about the cost of upgrading the chip.
You'll find the LM1 here , http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/products/lm1.php , and the cable here ,http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/x...cat=250&page=1.
I have been using an NGK , wide band sensor for a little while and it never "melted" , if the sensor melts then , you would have a lot of other stuff to think about !.
If you look through the Haltech section , you'd find that we shy away from the J&S because it can actually cause engine damage !!. because the J&S would be intercepting and retarding the ignition output trigger signal that is sent from the ECU to the LEADING coils without its (the ECU) knowledge , the timing on the trailing end remains the same and the leading coils can be actually be retarded soo much that they are caused to fire AFTER the trailing plugs , this would cause severe engine damage. Most after market systems dont have knock control , you simply have to relying on PROPER tuning , I personally employ the added protection of water injection.