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Stuck seal or timing problem?

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Old 04-22-07, 07:39 PM
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Stuck seal or timing problem?

Alright, this is kinda long. About a month ago, I noticed a couple of the top bolts on the tranny housing were loose so I tightened them. I jacked the car up and checked the bottom ones and tightened them, and while I was down there I figured I'd check the flywheel bolts too. So I turned the flywheel and checked three of the bolts and found the third one was a little loose, and since I have the RB flywheel and you need the nut on the back, I decided to work on it the next day on a lift on base, so I put the car back down and went to bed. The next morning I woke up and started the car, and it was running like ****. It sounded like it had a stuck seal. The last time I had a stuck seal it popped out after a minute or two of driving so I figured I'd go ahead and take it to work. I got about halfway and turned around. My boost was messed up too, the first turbo was OK but the second one had no power, it just dropped off. I put some Sea Foam into the engine and let it sit for a couple days, turning it over in the morning to make sure it got into all the seals. I started the car and got all the Sea Foam out, but it still ran like crap. I was told injectors might be a problem so I got some cleaned and flow tested injectors and installed them two weeks ago (I needed some anyway, mine were leaky and my car isn't flooded anymore when I try to start it), but the main problem still didn't go away. However, when we were driving the car after installing the injectors there was still a ton of smoke (yet another problem with my car) and still no power from the second turbo. We removed the tubing between the intercooler and intake elbow and drove it again. Oil was EVERYWHERE after that, so we concluded the turbos were blowing oil and might have been the cause of all the carbon buildup and running problem. So I swapped in a set of stock twins with half the miles mine had and drove it again. At or near WOT in first gear (and second IIRC), the power dropped off around 3k and started bucking really bad after that. I swapped out the check valves with the Viton ones from Dale Clark, and it's not bucking anymore but it still runs like crap. The day we swapped out the injectors we did a compression test I got 90 on one rotor and 95 on the other. I did another test today and got 90 on every single face with no skipping. The weird thing is it jumped from 0 to 90 every time, instead of somewhere like 75 to 90 like I was told. So, my question is this... WHAT THE HELL IS THE PROBLEM?! Haha. Actually, I'm just really confused cause all I did before all this started was turn the flywheel, albeit in the wrong direction. Could timing be an issue? I didn't think it would mess with timing, and I've been told it couldn't, but that's the only thing I can think of at this point, aside from the engine being gone, but with 90 it should still drive. What do the great minds of this forum think?
Old 04-22-07, 08:14 PM
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Oh yeah, I don't think I mentioned the huge crack my manifold had, here are some pics.
Attached Thumbnails Stuck seal or timing problem?-dsc01006.jpg   Stuck seal or timing problem?-dsc01007.jpg  
Old 04-23-07, 08:01 AM
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Bump. No one has encountered this or has an idea?
Old 04-23-07, 09:34 AM
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One word for you: paragraphs.


What ECU are you using?

Extremely doubtful you have any timing issues. I would be interested to know what all three pulses from each rotor were from your compression testing.
Old 04-23-07, 11:19 AM
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Yeah I guess paragraphs would make it easier huh? HAHA. Sorry about that.

I have the stock ECU still. I was just planning on getting a PFC but I might need the money for a rebuild now.

The needle jumped from 0 to 90 on each face, both rotors. It was jumping pretty fast though, and I took video so I'm gonna slow it down tonight and see exactly what happened. I just looked at the video again now and it looks like it might not have gotten to 90 a few times like I thought, but it's really hard to tell with the needle moving so fast, but it looks like the times it DIDN'T get to 90 weren't consistent though, so maybe I'm just seeing things.

^see, paragraphs, HAHA.

Oh, I forgot to mention too that when I drove it yesterday I was only getting about 5 to 7 psi of boost, before all this happened I was getting around 12 psi.
Old 04-23-07, 01:25 PM
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Have you check the ECU for any stored codes?
Old 04-23-07, 08:52 PM
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No I haven't. How exactly do I do that? Do I need the OBD1 tester or is it the "turn the key so many times" kinda thing? Someone else asked me if there was a way to reset the ECU.
Old 04-23-07, 09:11 PM
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ECU codes:
http://www.fd3s.net/engine_codes.html

To clear old codes: depress the brake pedal while the battery is disconnected
Old 04-24-07, 07:48 AM
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^Awesome, thanks! I'll check that out tonight. I thought I'd read that somewhere before, I keep forgetting about sites like that.

I tried to start the car last night and it won't even start now. The battery is going dead I believe. There was a couple times it acted like it wanted to start and run but died off again quickly. I was trying to inject a bit more Sea Foam in there starting at the elbow to clean out the TB and everything else too, from all the oil that used to be blown in there.
Old 04-24-07, 08:09 AM
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Could be a fuel problem?

Might be cause it happened to my friend, although he has a honda. Maybe you were running so rich, the car was choking itself. Now its just flooded itself out since you said it doesnt even want to start.

Or how bout a bad coil? Did you check those?
Old 04-24-07, 08:10 AM
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Did you knock any vac/boost lines off when you tightened the bolts on the tranny?? You did tighten some of them from the top I assume? If your car ran fine before you tightened the tranny I would say its a good bet you removed a vac/boost line when you fixed the tranny. (The map sensor is a common one....) It would do what you are explaining, many have done it before you, do you smell alot of gas when you crank it over??
Old 04-24-07, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by 1QWIK7
Could be a fuel problem?

Might be cause it happened to my friend, although he has a honda. Maybe you were running so rich, the car was choking itself. Now its just flooded itself out since you said it doesnt even want to start.

Or how bout a bad coil? Did you check those?
I don't THINK it's a fuel problem but who knows. A few months ago I changed/relocated the filter, I just swapped the leaky injectors two weeks ago...until last night the car actually started like it was supposed to after putting the new injectors in. I used to have to press the gas pedal all the way down to cut the fuel to start the car cause it was pretty much flooded every time, and now I don't have to do that. As a matter of fact, if I mash the pedal down now it won't start at all, so that's working. I think part of my problem is the battery is draining, I gotta hook it up to my other car to try again tonight. Also, I already had the hoses hooked up to suck the Sea Foam into it when I was trying to start it last night, so that might be part of it too. Might have just not had the chance to start before sucking it in and killing it, not sure. I haven't checked the coils, but I know I have good spark. A couple weeks ago when we did my injectors, my buddy checked for spark from the plugs and it was good. I don't remember if I mentioned this but I did see a spark under the TB when we were doing the comp check Sunday, but only when the wires weren't connected to the plugs, and when they were and it was running I didn't see the spark anymore.

Originally Posted by seandizzie
Did you knock any vac/boost lines off when you tightened the bolts on the tranny?? You did tighten some of them from the top I assume? If your car ran fine before you tightened the tranny I would say its a good bet you removed a vac/boost line when you fixed the tranny. (The map sensor is a common one....) It would do what you are explaining, many have done it before you, do you smell alot of gas when you crank it over??
No I didn't knock any lines off tightening the top bolts. I actually tightened those the day before I jacked the car up and messed with the bottom ones, and the car worked fine the day after I tightened the top ones (and yes I did tighten them from the top). I'm sure the line on the MAP sensor is still on too, I was just looking at that Sunday, checking over my lines when I swapped out the check valves. I don't smell alot of gas cranking it over, but I never really did though, even when it was flooded.

I'm about two steps away from just pulling it and rebuilding. If it was just power loss I'd feel better about it, but it's more about HOW the car is running...rough like a stuck seal, sounds more like a lawn mower or weed eater than a smooth running rotary. And it dies out if I don't keep my foot on the gas to keep it idling. Oh, and I slowed down the video and noticed it was only getting up to 80 psi instead of 90 like I thought.

Last edited by speedjunkie; 04-24-07 at 11:49 AM.
Old 04-24-07, 07:22 PM
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The way you worded the first post was, I did all the work and then went to bed and next day it ran rough, but that ain't right, correct.

So you tightened the top, drove the car, tightened the bottom and messed with the pressure plate then after that it ran like ****?? So it did run befor the seafoam, but real rough??

When did the turbo problem begin??

Is it geting 80psi on every rotor face??
Old 04-24-07, 10:48 PM
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I checked for codes tonight. I got 6 and 16. At first I thought the second one was 25, but I was mistaken. It kept repeating 6 and 16.

6- Speedometer sensor

16- EGR Switch (California only)

Originally Posted by seandizzie
The way you worded the first post was, I did all the work and then went to bed and next day it ran rough, but that ain't right, correct.

So you tightened the top, drove the car, tightened the bottom and messed with the pressure plate then after that it ran like ****?? So it did run befor the seafoam, but real rough??

When did the turbo problem begin??

Is it geting 80psi on every rotor face??
Yeah, originally I didn't mention that it was different days cause I didn't think it mattered, haha. I'll put it like this...Monday night, I noticed the top bolts were loose and I tightened them. Drove the car to work Tuesday, ran just fine, and jacked the car up and checked the bottom ones and turned the flywheel Tuesday night. Wednesday morning the car ran like **** and has ever since.

As far as the turbo...I've had alot of smoke at WOT for quite a while now, so it's probably been spitting oil for a while but didn't really affect the driveability of the car, and didn't give me any problems other than alot of smoke, so I never checked into it. I figured it was my cat even though another guy in my group kept telling me it was the turbos, haha.

I put in Sea Foam once before, after it was running like crap, and it didn't change anything. THIS time I was trying to get the Sea Foam in there before the TB so clean all that out too. I did notice just a little bit ago that the other side of the intercooler tubing wasn't tightened down all the way, haha, and I tried to start the car and it still wouldn't start. So tomorrow night I'm gonna jump it and try to get it started so I can drive it around and see what my power is like now. If that's what was causing so much power loss I'm gonna slit my wrists, haha. I didn't think to check that side of the hose cause I never take that one off, I just remove the elbow itself, but my buddy had taken that off when we drove it around and it blew oil all over everything and I forgot to tighten it back down. Now I'm eager to see what's up. It's still gonna run like **** though.

Yeah it looked like it was getting 80 on all faces, but I gotta look at it again.
Old 04-26-07, 06:20 PM
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Now the damn car won't even start. Last night I performed the deflooding procedures, to no avail. Most of the time I can put in brand new plugs and it fires right up, but the plugs I have in there are pretty new already. I guess I'll check for spark, fuel and all that, even though I'm pretty sure I have everything I need, just not working for some reason.
Old 05-02-07, 11:35 AM
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After taking about a week off, I messed with the car again last night. I tried to use the remote start switch again so I could check for spark but I couldn't get it to start the car, so that was out. I checked the main fuse to make sure it was good, and I listened to the fuel pump to make sure I was getting fuel, both of those were good. I put some MMO in the plug holes to aid compression, I hooked the battery up to my roommate's truck, and I even put brand new plugs in. Nothing. Damn thing just cranked and cranked. I'm about at wits end with this. I'm thinking rebuild. At least that way I'd know for sure just what the engine had, how many miles and all that. I don't even know any of that with this engine.
Old 05-02-07, 09:57 PM
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Old 05-03-07, 06:43 AM
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Haha, I might have to do that Rich. I'm just afraid I don't have enough money for all that. I'm going home on leave in about 3 weeks too, so I don't have much time to mess with this either. And of course money for the plane tickets is gonna take away from the car, that's what really hurts, haha.
Old 05-07-07, 10:07 AM
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Worked on the car again this weekend.

Saturday night- removed the plugs and cleaned them, turned the engine over while they were out to get out any excess fuel or whatever else was in there. Discovered my battery had 0 amps and only about 11.30 volts so I swapped out the battery. After all that it started right up but still didn't run right. I took it for a drive around the neighborhood and it started bucking under boost again. It wasn't consistent though, sometimes it would buck at 5psi, sometimes at 10psi. It also wasn't consistent with each gear either, first gear was worse than second, second was worse than third, etc. I couldn't really test at higher than third since I was still in my neighborhood. I was checking for spark before the test drive and noticed a spark by the trailing coil for the #1 rotor, between there and an exposed wire on the plug right next to it. It doesn't spark when the plug wires are connected, only when unplugged, which makes sense.

Sunday night- I checked the ignition coil IAW the FSM (it was good), and swapped the plug wires (I had a set of Magnacores laying around) for ***** and giggles, and taped up the exposed wire. I started the car and it ran for a minute or two and died. Last week I had adjusted the idle so it would stay running without my foot on the gas, but it still idled so low that it died last night. I tried to start it again after that and it wouldn't start. I was told to check a small wiring harness coming from the igniter so I'm going to check that tonight, along with making sure I hooked up the plug wires correctly.
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