How Not To Do A Double Throttle Removal
02-01-07, 11:53 PM
#1
Eye In The Sky
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How Not To Do A Double Throttle Removal
They were doing good until it came to filling up the shaft hole.
They threaded the hole, but evidently did not have a bolt that fit the threads.
So they stuck a smaller bolt through the hole and used THREE nuts to insure that the bolt did not come loose.
They threaded the hole, but evidently did not have a bolt that fit the threads.
So they stuck a smaller bolt through the hole and used THREE nuts to insure that the bolt did not come loose.
02-02-07, 12:07 AM
#3
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Originally Posted by windom
Haha. I would assume the correct way is to use a block off plate? My UIM was already modified when I bought it.
(1) block off plate
(2) threaded and a bolt screwed in from the outside and long enough to be ground flush with the inner surface
(3) welded up from the inside and ground flush
02-02-07, 12:47 AM
#7
Weird Cat Man
I used a pipe-threaded allen-keyed plug.
This gives a smooth finish on the outside, pretty flush on the inside, and due to the pipe threads, it can not screw itself inwards and fall into the engine. At the absolute worst, it could work loose and fall outside. I used Loctite
Similar to this:http://www.americanfastener.com/imag...hspec/318a.gif
This gives a smooth finish on the outside, pretty flush on the inside, and due to the pipe threads, it can not screw itself inwards and fall into the engine. At the absolute worst, it could work loose and fall outside. I used Loctite
Similar to this:http://www.americanfastener.com/imag...hspec/318a.gif
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02-02-07, 10:49 AM
#13
i think i did a pretty sweet job
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/removed-welded-double-throttle-assembly-pics-571092/
https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generation-specific-1993-2002-16/removed-welded-double-throttle-assembly-pics-571092/
02-04-07, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by t-von
Properly done or not, the mod is still gonna flow better than stock. Not everyone has access to all the neccessary equipment.
02-04-07, 02:25 PM
#18
Recovering Miataholic
Silly question, but why remove the double-throttle assembly? From the 1994 factory workshop manual, page F-137:
DOUBLE THROTTLE CONTROL SYSTEM
Description
The response delay of the manifold absolute pressure sensor followed by rapid acceleration temporarily causes a lean fuel mixture. The double throttle control system prevents hesitation caused by this lean fuel mixture by slightly delaying the opening of the double throttle valve after the secondary throttle valve.
The double throttle valve is controlled by the PCME through the solenoid valve.
Given Mazda's explanation, what are the reasons for removing it?
DOUBLE THROTTLE CONTROL SYSTEM
Description
The response delay of the manifold absolute pressure sensor followed by rapid acceleration temporarily causes a lean fuel mixture. The double throttle control system prevents hesitation caused by this lean fuel mixture by slightly delaying the opening of the double throttle valve after the secondary throttle valve.
The double throttle valve is controlled by the PCME through the solenoid valve.
Given Mazda's explanation, what are the reasons for removing it?
02-04-07, 05:07 PM
#21
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The reason is to remove an unnecessary restriction in the intake track.
Horse power junkies do everything to gain that last bit of power.
It was primarily installed to prevent stupid owners from trying to go on high boost when the engine is still cold.
Horse power junkies do everything to gain that last bit of power.
It was primarily installed to prevent stupid owners from trying to go on high boost when the engine is still cold.
02-04-07, 06:06 PM
#22
Original Gangster/Rotary!
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Originally Posted by cewrx7r1
The reason is to remove an unnecessary restriction in the intake track.
Horse power junkies do everything to gain that last bit of power.
It was primarily installed to prevent stupid owners from trying to go on high boost when the engine is still cold.
Horse power junkies do everything to gain that last bit of power.
It was primarily installed to prevent stupid owners from trying to go on high boost when the engine is still cold.
02-04-07, 11:17 PM
#23
Recovering Miataholic
Not comfortable with the above answers. Mazda says clearly that the reason is delay in the response of the MAP sensor causing a temporary lean mixture on sudden acceleration. How does "going non-sequential" or "going single" change that? Seems like you would need a faster-responding MAP sensor, or some other compensation for the "temporarily lean mixture," to allow removal of the double throttle.
02-04-07, 11:45 PM
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Originally Posted by wstrohm
Not comfortable with the above answers. Mazda says clearly that the reason is delay in the response of the MAP sensor causing a temporary lean mixture on sudden acceleration.
************************************************** *************
Then why does Mazda need the "Accelerator Injector" and "Injector vs TPS" tables which richens up the fuel when you make sudden throttle movements to prevent leanest as you mentioned?
From page F-12 of the manual. We call it a BOV and Mazda calls it an "Air Bypass Valve". Here is Mazda's listed function for it: Reduces sound of air entering air cleaner from turbocharger deceleration. It is not a silencer but the actual valve that dumps the mentioned air.
From page F-111, the fuction of the Solenoid Valve (fuel pressure regulator).
"To prevent vapor lock during hot restart idle, vacuum to the FPR is momentarily cut, and fuel pressure is increased." You rarely get vapor lock in high pressure FI systems with pusher pumps in the gas tank. VL is really associated with carb engines with the old sucking fuel pumps on the engine block. Mine has been off for many years and living in friggin hot Houston summers, I have never never had vapor lock.
You have the freedom to be uncomfortbale. Rick and I aren't because we know more about these cars.
02-05-07, 01:11 AM
#25
Recovering Miataholic
You can't believe everthing you read.
Knowledge and experinence is more important.
Then why does Mazda need the "Accelerator Injector" and "Injector vs TPS" tables which richens up the fuel when you make sudden throttle movements to prevent leanest as you mentioned?
From page F-12 of the manual. We call it a BOV and Mazda calls it an "Air Bypass Valve". Here is Mazda's listed function for it: Reduces sound of air entering air cleaner from turbocharger deceleration. It is not a silencer but the actual valve that dumps the mentioned air.
From page F-111, the fuction of the Solenoid Valve (fuel pressure regulator).
"To prevent vapor lock during hot restart idle, vacuum to the FPR is momentarily cut, and fuel pressure is increased."
"To prevent vapor lock during hot restart idle, vacuum to the FPR is momentarily cut, and fuel pressure is increased."
You have the freedom to be uncomfortbale. Rick and I aren't because we know more about these cars.
Your point is still not clear to me: Are you saying the double-throttle system is not necessary for any reason whatsoever? Or that it doesn't work as advertised? Or that Mazda is wrong about the MAP sensor delay? Or that the MAP sensor delay is already taken care of by some other "tables?" (Please keep in mind that I do not believe everything I read.)