David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

EDIT: Elliot got in before my post.

^ Saw your car while I was at DGRR. Really nice looking and some quality work.

Adaptronic right? Does it have a fuel cutoff map? Almost sounds like that but what do I know? Hope you get it sorted out soon.

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

I'm removing this post for now as this can be discussed at a later date when the issue is confirmed.

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Thank you David

Yes, the car does have a deceleration fuel cut map, however, it is disabled.

Hopefully its merely a simple setting that needs to be tweeked.

How is yours coming?

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

David,

We all want it resolved! There is a reason I came in person to tune this car originally . Moving forward I have been asking for ecu files and datalogs from day one, pretty sure I have not gotten both( also since there were fueling related issue, I assumed it could be part of the problem, or the entire problem).

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Agreed, and my intention is not point fingers at the ECU, we just cannot rule out any possibilty. Its just quite frustating at this point, but I want nothing more than to utilize this 1280s to its fullest potential.

Thanks for your attention on this matter.

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

I am sure Elliot with help to get this resolved. He's a great guy and a good resource.

My car should be done this week or early next week at the latest. I am going to head on down to Kilo's mid next month for the tuning/dyno session and then to take it home. DGRR showed me why we keep at this stuff as the FD is an amazing car. Can't wait to drive once again up here in the mountains of NC.

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

I hope to see your car one day. Its been an iconic part of this rotary community.

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Finally got this car on the road again!

I want to thank Zach Young for all of his help. Tuning this car was a very extensive process, there were alot of bugs to workout, fuel system etc. Customer service was top-notch, communication was on point. These guys have character, a rarity these days. And best of all, they are in the business of getting you a running car back as quickly as possible!

The car is setup to make anywhere between 8psi - 17psi (480rwhp-630rwhp)

After trailering it back all day, I took it out last night around 8pm. I figured I'd start out 8psi with the EBC turned off. I hit it in 1st gear up a hill towards my neighborhood. 1st 2nd 3rd Absolutely blew my mind. Then tried 10psi on the interstate. Peak boost registered as 10.8psi on the Greddy Profec.

10psi feels like a space shuttle. Its only 550rwhp @ 10psi (not too much more than last engine) but the delivery/feel is just motivating. Its incredible, worth every penney! I guess its the torque/punch, but as soon as you hit the throttle its just explosion like being shot out of a cannon. Car is sticking pretty well to the ground, but I'm flat out overwhelmed by the power. I thought I'd need 750+, but I'm damn near scared for my life.

The best way I can think to describe the 20b vs a 13b; the 13b takes much longer to wind up and the power if very concentrated at the top, this engine just feels like you are pinned to the seat as soon as the throttle goes down, and then just pins you harder and harder and harder and harder and harder lol. Its downright mindnumbing to look down see only 10lbs of boost passing you through the gears like so. To think that this motor isn't even stressed!

No joke, I'm afraid to go higher boost Going to slowly work my way up to 17psi.




The only downside is that there was an unsolvable injector staging hiccup. It can be felt at the pri/sec transition. Zach put ridiculous amounts of time into the ECU without charing me any extra, simply trying to get this thing as close to stock as possible. This guy is a masterful tuner, very close attention to detail, and treats the car as if its his own, so I don't doubt his competency. Its not too bad, but there's a little glitch right as boost comes online. Also, the throttle tip-in settings have been worked over and over again but still there's a ever present bucking if you snap down quickly on the throttle from zero percent. At this point, there's just not enough time and money left to keep tweaking with it so just going to have to learn to live with it. I'll try sending the map to adaptronic guys and see if there's anything additional that they can think of, but at this point I'm just tired.


Stay tuned for a video! Trying to get my ***** together to try that 17psi pull!

t-von

iTrader: (8)

You keep this up, your gonna make me want to put a single in my 20b sooner than later. The one thing I love about a 20b in this power range, is you dont need water injection or e85 to make that power reliably. That's why I would never build a 13b that needs all that stuff to be safe. Too much stuff to worry about. It's nice to go anywhere and put regular gas in the tank without stressing. Glad your enjoying the benefits of these conversions.

stokrx

QUOTE=Monsterbox;11908190

10psi feels like a space shuttle. Its only 550rwhp @ 10psi (not too much more than last engine) but the delivery/feel is just motivating. Its incredible, worth every penney! I guess its the torque/punch, but as soon as you hit the throttle its just explosion like being shot out of a cannon. Car is sticking pretty well to the ground, but I'm flat out overwhelmed by the power. I thought I'd need 750+, but I'm damn near scared for my life.

[/QUOTE]

Haha, nice write up! It true once you go 20B, you'll never go back!!

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Thanks guys, its certainly worth all the effort. Mazda should have made 20b's a factory option. It just makes too much sense and feels all too right. The sound, the around town torque, and the HP/psi is damn near perfection.



A girl has constantly been poking at me about this project. "you're never going to finish, you keep saying 2 more weeks." You guys know how it is; Outsiders have no idea whats going on, they just think we waste time tinkering. "Your little race car thing isn't going to scare me"

Well, strap this chick in last night. She's acting all tough, texting etc. Get on the on-ramp and merge with about quarter throttle. Sounds pretty loud, a passenger might think its going WOT if you didn't know better "I'm still not scared." Nail it WOT top of 3rd at 70mph @ 10psi, wastegate screams open, smell of tires as the thing squats and they nick the rear fenders, rocketship into 4th and pin it out at 7.5k. "wtf I hate your car! please stop! dont do that again!"


Case closed.

KNONFS

iTrader: (14)

LOL!

Congrats on the build

Troclo

I told you.
(and we should be scared, nearly lost the car 2 days ago as the wheel spun on the freeway ramp in 3rd. Gonna try to configure my boost so it comes a little more subtle)

That said I hit +120 mph every single day if only just for 10-15 sec these days…

It my new favorite drug! luckily my wife have no idea what a 600 hp car is!!!

Turblown

iTrader: (12)

Are we going to see you doing the give your mom a car ride youtube video ?

This is the first E1280S Zach has tuned and like I tell most people it is very complicated setup wise. Tuning is easy, setup is not. I am more than positive it just needs more work with both in those two areas. David when get a moment can you please send me the ecu file and a log of both conditions?

P.S. Keep the shiny side up!

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

LOL,

Yes I will do so this weekend (not the mom ride, but maybe someone elses mom). I'm going to try increasing the asynchronous accelerator pump gain to 200% and lowering the threashold. Its behaving like it needs more burst fuel, apart from engine rotation / MAP

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Agreed on the drug!

I've yet to encourter serious wheel spin in 3rd. I think it will happen at higher boost when I get my ***** together. How do you handle this when it happens?


My car likes to slide the *** end to the right, in 2nd gear at the rev limiter when it begins to spin. I just clutch in immediately and upshift to keep forward momentum while rolling roll back in it.

However, I'm beginning wonder if this method may not be the best as it could cause lift off oversteer at higher g-force acceleration. But, it seems alot safer to me then half-way / quarter way letting up on throttle "feathering" as they say. Up shifting seems safer because if you accidentally panic and let out too hard while you still in gear then your going to nose dive and snap over from the gearing / decel.

My biggest fear is spinning out on the interstate lol and this car makes this reality possible

RCCAZ 1

iTrader: (10)

^^Stay calm and modulate your right foot

Monsterbox

iTrader: (6)

Easier said then done when all limbs have 20b Parkinson's disorder

unwritten-dinasty

Amazing build David. Pretty much all i have to say.

Enjoy the car, you deserve it, remember it will be mine next lol

stickmantijuana

iTrader: (1)

our cars are 50/50 balanced and if anything little heavier in the front with the 20b. most of us also put larger tires in the back. what all these mean is that our cars are set to understeer.

when I lift off, it never swings the rear out. even in a corner, if you let go of gas, it settles back down. so when things get dicey, just come off boost. It isn't like lambo or lotus where you need to keep foot planted. only time I got in trouble was when I was being really dumb and floored it out of a corner without sufficient countersteer. I suppose you theoretically can worsen oversteer if you brake hard when your rear is out, but you never should be in that situation.

bottomline is, I wouldn't worry about the car loosing rear end on decel. if your rear end is sliding out, just come off boost. that's ALL you need to do as long as your alignment is good.

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

^ I'd offer the opposite advice and that is to add some throttle if/when the rear starts to slide out. FDs like to slide when cornering and the way I've been taught at the track to control this by applying more throttle. That settles the car down and gets it under control. If you take away throttle, it just adds to the issue.

The person who taught me this is an FD instructor and I never felt the difference until a few track events ago, when I applied this principle and the car reacted positively by coming back under control. This allows you to hit more of the limit of car in a controlled fashion.

Of course, I am not an expert but a middle of the road track guy so maybe the experts will disagree.

stickmantijuana

iTrader: (1)

david, I don't think that was the question. yes, on a track, to go faster around a corner, you should try to find balance with the gas pedal.

I was under impression the OP wanted to be safe trying to go straight on a freeway. If your rear is sliding out while going straight on a freeway due to wheel spin, you should not add more power to get it back in control. just let go of gas, and in my experience, that will straighten the car out.

David Hayes

iTrader: (6)

^ Sorry, wasn't really sure what you were referring to. I'd say the safest way to avoid spinning on the highway is to never get in the situation. The 20B turbo requires you to make good decisions as the power band can get you in trouble.

On thing we did on my car is to make boost come on more slowly so as to avoid the massive wheel spin when the turbo kicks in.

Troclo

I just let go of the accelerator and steer my way out of it, no brakes no shift,
I think the traction from the engine is what gets you back in line when the *** has gone walkabout. It had been raining earlier that day, so I might have caught a wet spot. Had no problems yesterday running at 16 psi, 3rd gear flat out.

silverfdturbo6port

iTrader: (26)

My car always required more throttle to keep control when it kicked sideways when ripping around. fds have great control. Keep the wheel straight and give it hell. Its when you let off when going sideways and let the tires get traction that will get you into trouble and start slingshotting.