k4adams

OK, I'm confused as hell. Yes, I've read - I've read more since getting my 1984 GSL-SE than I think I have my whole life combined, and the more I read, seems the more confused. I got this ride 2 months ago - it's in damn good shape (100k), but needs shocks bad. Front passenger is completely shot, and driver side is not much better. Also, got bushings in the back making all kinds of noises. So, I read, and read, and read. Just when I think I know what to get, I read some more, and then it's "oh ****".

What I'm wanting is a smooth ride, with perhaps some upgraded handling. This will be used as the regular ride and there will be lots of highway miles. I do NOT plan on racing

Here's what I've got ordered:

RB spring set
Tokiko blues up front
KYB in the back (tokiko blues on back order until July)
shock mounts for up front
energy suspension bushing set

Here's my questions:

1) Does this setup sound about right?
2) I've read about NOT using poly bushing in the rear - I can send those back and get whatever, but WHAT DO I NEED? Again, smooth ride is important, but I do have noises coming from rear bushings now (sprayed with some WD40 to confirm source of sound)
3) I got the red poly bushings -- I didn't read about the squeaking until after ordered -- is that still an issue with the red?
4) Using the RB springs and tokikos up front - I've read about camber adjustment from others, but I'm pretty much clueless. Will the guys at the shop know how to handle this? It's not a race shop - just ordinary exhaust/brake/shocks place.

I'm sure there's more I forgot to ask, but I'm getting frustrated at reading and reading and still not knowing exactly what to do. Any help is much appreciated.

Kdo58

Do you face book? There is a 1 generation rx7 group and a there is discussion right now about suspension.

k4adams

yeah -- that's prob the one I started today

JSmall

I've got energy suspension bushes in the whole rear of my car.. Makes the car a lot nicer to drive and feels more together if that makes sense?

GSLSEforme

1st piece of advice,order the Tokico blues and wait for them to come in-or shop around to find them elsewhere. The KYB is a lesser quality shock and will not complement the RB springs. They would be "ok" with stock springs. If you do Tokico front/KYB rear you will notice the front of car handles/rides great,back not so much..not bouncy but not predictable/planted like front-save your money get the Tokiko shocks. You can do all other work and replace them when they come in and be able to drive car in meantime. Urethane bushings (all) in front are excellent idea,include a larger swaybar while suspension is all apart. You'll be glad afterwards. On the back,new bushings surely are better than old,i have done energy suspension on some other Rx7s' i've owned. Definitely tightens up back of car-a little too much though. Went a slightly different way with SE i did recently. The only way to renew all oe bushings in rear links & watts linkage is to replace all links, look on Mazdatrix website, lotsa $$. Some are ok with urethane bushings in rear of car, for just cruising around should be ok. Hope this helps.

k4adams

Thanks GSLSEforum -- this does help tremendously. I do have some follow up questions. Should I get the watts link pivot bracket also for the rear? And, if doing work up front, would you suggest going ahead and replacing all tie rod ends, idler arm, and lower bushings now? I'm not sure if their loose, but the car is 35 years old with 100k miles - I'm sure their not in original state anymore. Suggestions?

miasmicmonky

iTrader: (1)

I would skip the kyb's in the rear and get some higher performance mustang shocks. They will handle the RB springs better and are easy to find.

GSLSEforme

Get back to you after work

GSLSEforme

You're not doing the work yourself? Don't know the skillset of guys at shop you're going to,this work is not really technical but you want it done correctly...the first time. Will try to answer some of your questions. Open one of the strut mount boxes and look at the mount,open hood and look how it's mounted in car. You will see the center is offset. It can be oriented in four different positions,this is how camber and caster is adjusted on your car. On the car they may be oriented in different positions from the factory when car initially assembled. When your rebuilt struts are installed back in the car,turn the strut mount so the center(part that bulges up that strut body goes thru attached with big nut) is facing toward windshield and in toward the engine both left and right sides, and install them in this position. You can look at the car and the strut mount you have in your hand. Turn the mount in your hand so you can see how the offset will change the installed position of the strut. This will give the car maximum negative camber and maximum positive caster. Color of urethane bushings does not matter,what does is liberal use on assembly/install of the grease supplied with them-nothing else should be used. The only place it should not be used is on swaybar endlink bushings. I don't see them in your list of purchased bushings,suggest these be replaced as their oe bushings are certain to be cracked/rotted.

GSLSEforme

Last post started turning into a book....if you're referring to the reinforcement bracket for watts link pivot you see on Mazdatrix website, i think in your stock level powered car it's not a necessity. Regarding steering linkage: pitman arm, idler arm,inner & outer tie rod ends like any other car should be checked for play AND condition of grease boots on each. If all the components are serviceable(tight) and it's possible they are,if the boots are cracked/torn ,replace them. The boots are to keep lubricating grease in and weather out. Think of driving in the rain and all the crap that gets sprayed up onto them. There is an upgrade i recommend for the idler arm made by Moog that makes a big difference in steering feel and it will likely never wear out. I don't remember the part # at the moment but will find it for you. When all work is completed you'll want to get a proper front end alignment done on car. Think i covered all your questions,any more ask away.

GSLSEforme

Moog idler arm # K9369 @ $50.00 most part stores. Rock Auto stocks it. When you have it in your hand and compare it to what's on the car..beefy is what comes to mind. Even if your oe idler arm is good,still recommend upgrading to this . GL

k4adams

Thanks GSLSEForme -- I think that answers about all my questions. I'm gonna return the KYB rears and put off the back job a bit. I'll go ahead and put the RB springs and tokiko blues up front, and any poly bushings I have for up front. I'll have the tie rods and ball joints checked, and wheel bearings. I'm also going to go ahead and order an idler arm and prob a RB front sway bar, and throw that all on there with a full brake job up front next month.

For the rear, I'll wait on the tokiko blues and install those and the RB springs. I'll bite the bullet and get all the new links from mazdatrix. And new brake job in back also -- anything I'm missing in the back, or front? I want to have the suspension and steering like brand new, then I'll move to exhaust and finally paint job - them I'm done

miasmicmonky

iTrader: (1)

Rather than waiting for the Tokico rears, I would seriously just get something like the Koni STr.T for an 87-93 mustang. They bolt in perfectly, are supposedly stiffer than the Tokico, are much easier to get ahold of, and are cheaper. I bought a set a couple of weeks ago for about $60 a side vs the tokico 90 a side. They feel great compared to the KYB's I had on at first. and they look great being orange! No modifications were needed to make them fit either!

Oh and I expect to be ordering the Tokicos up front soon as there isn't much better (bought some KYB back when Tokico was unobtanium) and I haven't seen any good information on how to fit the MR2 struts up front which I would rather have as they seem to already account for being a half inch lower than our fronts.

Carl

iTrader: (2)

It looks like the tokico blue rears may be available again at Racing Beat. Did not come up as out of stock when I just looked (unlike what it did last fall when I was searching for some).

GSLSEforme

Get an energy suspension rear sway bar/end link kit,clean up and reuse stock bar on back. Will work good with RB bar up front. Be advised a minor mod needs to be done to use that bar,results are well worth it.

GSLSEforme

Orientation of strut mount for max-camber/max+caster

k4adams

Perfect! Taking the ride to rack tomorrow and putting all the front parts on. I also saw your pulley post - much appreciated. The exhaust job will be done in March. Thanks again

chuyler1

iTrader: (1)

Since I didn't see it mentioned, but I'm pretty sure it says it on the Mazdatrix site (and every other blog post or website dedicated to 1st gen suspension tuning)...

Do not use poly bushings on the watts linkage, especially if you have lowered the car. It causes the linkage to bind up and introduces snap oversteer. Double check that Energy suspension kit and if you have someone install everything for you, do not give them those bushings. If your car needs the bushings replaced, buy the OEM rubber kit from Mazdatrix instead.

And to confirm what others have said, RB springs and Tokico Blues front and back are a great firm street setup. Wait until your blues come in. Don't bother with the KYBs unless you're sticking with stock ride height and spring rates.

k4adams

I had read, and been warned on using the poly in the rear, and decided against. I'm getting new arms and links for the rear, and waiting on the tokiko blues for the rear. Car is at the shop now getting the RB springs and tokiko blues on the front, with new bushings, links, tie rod ends, ball joints, and idler arm. This forum is great for help and information. Thanks

aeenox

Hey Guys,

I will be installing some tokico illuminas on the front my car next week. I bought new strut tops, boots and bump stops. Is it true that I will need to trim the bumps stop down? Also what kind of oil do I need to add to the strut housing before I put in the new insert?

Thanks,

chuyler1

iTrader: (1)

Yes you should cut around 1/3 off the bump stops front and rear. Fill the front housings with antifreeze.

GSLSEforme

You make no mention in your post about replacing springs(lowering car),if you're staying at stock ride height there is no need to modify bumpstops. On my SE i installed RB springs,Tokico Blues all around. This lowered car approx 3/4". I did not cut my bump stops and have yet to compress the suspension enough to touch bump stops, even deliberately choosing roads to test for it. YMMV,just putting what i experienced out there. Any oil will suffice,recommend a lower viscosity. I used 5W-30 in my strut housings, enough to fill housing with strut inserted to about2" from top-doesn't take much oil. The oil is to allow the shock insert to transfer its heat to strut housing to keep it cool.

chuyler1

iTrader: (1)

After your car settles after installing RB springs, you can visually see how close the bump stops are in the rear. If you haven't cut them, and they are original, you are hitting them without question under hard cornering which only adds to the snap oversteer.

GSLSEforme

Thanks for your concern,have measured ride height before doing work,afterward and during each of the two alignments done. Car didn't settle any more after two months,been almost a year now. May consider cutting 1/2 coil off rear springs,would trim bumpstops then...