I'm back in the 1st gen game... My new 1980
09-23-13, 12:23 PM
#51
I'm not sure about DGRR. I've never been because I work so much so its hard to get time off.
About if I knew any history on the car, I purchased it from the original owner with a 2 inch thick stack of paper work and receipts in a folder dating back to the mid 80s. I'm pretty sure one of the tail lights was completely replaced in the mid 90s. The door/window seals are shot and are on my list. Everything else is solid since this car was garage kept since it was new.
Ive had this Mazdatrix plate frame for 5-6 years now. I think this is the 3rd car its been on. Not bad for a free part!
About if I knew any history on the car, I purchased it from the original owner with a 2 inch thick stack of paper work and receipts in a folder dating back to the mid 80s. I'm pretty sure one of the tail lights was completely replaced in the mid 90s. The door/window seals are shot and are on my list. Everything else is solid since this car was garage kept since it was new.
Ive had this Mazdatrix plate frame for 5-6 years now. I think this is the 3rd car its been on. Not bad for a free part!
01-19-14, 09:55 PM
#53
UPDATE...
Well, the engine is ready to pull. The original engine blew a coolant seal. It is possible that the front rotor housing is cracked somewhere near the exhaust port allowing coolant into the engine and exhaust into the coolant system. While rotating the engine by hand with the header off, coolant trickles up and out of the tiny secondary exhaust ports (heat ex changer ports).
So I have two options...
Rebuild the 12a with a new front housing. Probably the cheapest way out.
OR, 13b swap with a side draft carb
Well, the engine is ready to pull. The original engine blew a coolant seal. It is possible that the front rotor housing is cracked somewhere near the exhaust port allowing coolant into the engine and exhaust into the coolant system. While rotating the engine by hand with the header off, coolant trickles up and out of the tiny secondary exhaust ports (heat ex changer ports).
So I have two options...
Rebuild the 12a with a new front housing. Probably the cheapest way out.
OR, 13b swap with a side draft carb
01-20-14, 12:22 PM
#54
Actually, your biggest challenge will be to buy an NOS 12a housing. Esp an 80, since the 79/80 housing is unique, front vs rear (FBs are both the same). And _if_ you find one, likely most NOS ones are sold in pairs. And these are not cheap. I know of an outfit in Seattle that is (was?) selling off sets of 80-spec housings at something in the neighborhood of $1500 a pair. I had to source mine thru a friend in europe - and he found them in Japan!
jeez...
An option might be ebay. I have seen several 12a housings with minimal flaking at the edges (certainly usable) in the $150+ range. But again, you either need to find the 80-spec OR switch out BOTH housings to FBs.
Might be worth shopping around at Atkins, Pineappleracing, Mazdatrix etc to see if they have a housing.
As a side note, the Mazdatrix 13b rebuild DVD is a great help. $30 well spent...
Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska
jeez...
An option might be ebay. I have seen several 12a housings with minimal flaking at the edges (certainly usable) in the $150+ range. But again, you either need to find the 80-spec OR switch out BOTH housings to FBs.
Might be worth shopping around at Atkins, Pineappleracing, Mazdatrix etc to see if they have a housing.
As a side note, the Mazdatrix 13b rebuild DVD is a great help. $30 well spent...
Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska
01-20-14, 07:30 PM
#55
Ill probably get the video if i need to rebuild a 13b or 12a. Ive watched aaron cakes videos a few times, and ive torn several of them apart so in theory it shouldnt be too hard to rebuild one. The only thing that worries me is over torqing something or pinchining a seal. Hoping i can luck out and find a good one to just drop in. I have a pair of 83 hpusings with just a hair of flaking on the outet edge. Otherwise theyre ok.
01-22-14, 07:49 PM
#59
If i go 13b ive been eying the rotary shack weber side draft. Unless i can find a great deal on something used id rather buy a new carb package. I dont like the 45dcoe that much so well see...
If i stay 12a im keeping the nikki and everything just like it was.
If i stay 12a im keeping the nikki and everything just like it was.
01-25-14, 01:03 AM
#60
Progress...
Engine is out. I did some cleaning. Hopefully i can piece something together soon and have it back on the road.
Btw i pulled the engine without a hoist. I rigged a chain to the rafters and lifted the engine out by hand lol. I get pretty serious when i want something done! I called around everywhere and nobody had a hoist in stock!
Engine is out. I did some cleaning. Hopefully i can piece something together soon and have it back on the road.
Btw i pulled the engine without a hoist. I rigged a chain to the rafters and lifted the engine out by hand lol. I get pretty serious when i want something done! I called around everywhere and nobody had a hoist in stock!
01-25-14, 07:31 AM
#61
Yeah, you can hurt yourself if you're not careful pulling that out by yourself. I saw a guy in a junkyard take out a 13B by himself. I was impressed. Glad to see you're making progress! Looks all too familiar.
I had been wondering how I was going to torque down the 2-1/8" nut on the back of my engine and hadn't thought of the chain idea you have set up there - very nice! The best ideas are the ones that are simple, and that idea completely escaped me. I had planned to use a piece of angle iron but your chain makes that even more simple, so thanks for the idea!
Keep up the good work - keeps me inspired to move forward.
I had been wondering how I was going to torque down the 2-1/8" nut on the back of my engine and hadn't thought of the chain idea you have set up there - very nice! The best ideas are the ones that are simple, and that idea completely escaped me. I had planned to use a piece of angle iron but your chain makes that even more simple, so thanks for the idea!
Keep up the good work - keeps me inspired to move forward.
01-25-14, 08:27 AM
#63
Rotartist
iTrader: (13)
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Spring Hill TN 37174
Posts: 7,252
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Progress...
Engine is out. I did some cleaning. Hopefully i can piece something together soon and have it back on the road.
Btw i pulled the engine without a hoist. I rigged a chain to the rafters and lifted the engine out by hand lol. I get pretty serious when i want something done! I called around everywhere and nobody had a hoist in stock!
Engine is out. I did some cleaning. Hopefully i can piece something together soon and have it back on the road.
Btw i pulled the engine without a hoist. I rigged a chain to the rafters and lifted the engine out by hand lol. I get pretty serious when i want something done! I called around everywhere and nobody had a hoist in stock!
Dude.. You still have my number.. I have a hoist you can borrow... When you go to put it back together come snag mine..
01-25-14, 12:01 PM
#64
Great time for all-new heater/coolant hoses, new oil cooler mount rubbers (yours WILL be cracked).
Did my 12a pull on my own too, but with a Hoist!
For my rear shaft nut (and front too) I just slid the block into my subie wagon and took it to my (non-rotary) mechanic's shop and he buzzed them of with his air gun in seconds (I supplied the socket for the rear nut). Will do the reverse on assembly...
'luck as you go...
Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska
Did my 12a pull on my own too, but with a Hoist!
For my rear shaft nut (and front too) I just slid the block into my subie wagon and took it to my (non-rotary) mechanic's shop and he buzzed them of with his air gun in seconds (I supplied the socket for the rear nut). Will do the reverse on assembly...
'luck as you go...
Stu Aull
80GS
Alaska
01-25-14, 07:48 PM
#65
Im supposed to meet up with Chad tomorrow. He has a s3 13b ive had my eye on. Trevor, PM me your number again please.
I plan on taking this swap slow. Im going to replace and clean bits and pieces as i go. Most of the hoses have been replaced since ive had the car except the one heater hose behind the engine and the oil cooler lines, which may need to be replaced anyway right? Are s3 13b and s1 12a lines a different thread pitch?
Im going to attempt to do a complete fuel injection swap on this one guys. So, a few questions...
-13B clutch is needed? 81 up is the larger diameter right? I am keeping the SA transmission.
-12A or 13b starter?
-12A dizzy and ignition is incompatible on the EFI?
-12A radiator and shroud is compatible with the swap?
I plan on taking this swap slow. Im going to replace and clean bits and pieces as i go. Most of the hoses have been replaced since ive had the car except the one heater hose behind the engine and the oil cooler lines, which may need to be replaced anyway right? Are s3 13b and s1 12a lines a different thread pitch?
Im going to attempt to do a complete fuel injection swap on this one guys. So, a few questions...
-13B clutch is needed? 81 up is the larger diameter right? I am keeping the SA transmission.
-12A or 13b starter?
-12A dizzy and ignition is incompatible on the EFI?
-12A radiator and shroud is compatible with the swap?
01-25-14, 09:53 PM
#67
life's a drag*)
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: greenville,sc
Posts: 813
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I went through this when I did my 80 project to use your sa transmission with the se engine. All you have to do is use the stock 84-85 clutch kit and flywheel for the se engine, and your 1980 starter with the 80 transmission. 79-82 use the small 215mm clutch 83-85 use the bigger 225mm one.
10-25-14, 04:52 PM
#69
Update.
A lot has been done since my last post here. The car is about 3000 miles deep into the new engine. It has run flawlessly.
1)Eibach Ground Controls. 8 inch, 200 lbs front unkown rear (NOS kit for FB)
2)KYB GR2 shocks and struts.
3)Rebuilt front end. MOOG idler arm. Ball joints, inner and outer tie rods, front brake pads and rotors.
4)Stripped and rebuilt Nikki.
5)New carpet, reupholstered 83 door panels.
6)Simplified engine wiring.
7)Optima battery.
8)Pinstripe removed.
9)New OEM MAZDA and SAVANNA RX-7 badges.
10)Mazdatrix floor mats.
11)Techno Toy Tuning camber and thrust bearing plate.
12)83 LE ow back seats.
13)LED guage cluster bulbs.
A lot has been done since my last post here. The car is about 3000 miles deep into the new engine. It has run flawlessly.
1)Eibach Ground Controls. 8 inch, 200 lbs front unkown rear (NOS kit for FB)
2)KYB GR2 shocks and struts.
3)Rebuilt front end. MOOG idler arm. Ball joints, inner and outer tie rods, front brake pads and rotors.
4)Stripped and rebuilt Nikki.
5)New carpet, reupholstered 83 door panels.
6)Simplified engine wiring.
7)Optima battery.
8)Pinstripe removed.
9)New OEM MAZDA and SAVANNA RX-7 badges.
10)Mazdatrix floor mats.
11)Techno Toy Tuning camber and thrust bearing plate.
12)83 LE ow back seats.
13)LED guage cluster bulbs.
10-25-14, 07:59 PM
#71
I like how your engine bay turned out. Simple, elegant, and the RB UFO shaped air cleaner assembly looks good.
Any plans for direct fire? Mechanical secondaries? Hogged out Nikki? Light steel flywheel? Long primary? I'd go crazy having to drive a setup with stock ignition, vacuum secs/stock 20mm venturis, 30 pound flywheel, short collected exhaust. I'd have to change something.
Otherswise looks good. I'm glad the R5 is running so well for you.
Any plans for direct fire? Mechanical secondaries? Hogged out Nikki? Light steel flywheel? Long primary? I'd go crazy having to drive a setup with stock ignition, vacuum secs/stock 20mm venturis, 30 pound flywheel, short collected exhaust. I'd have to change something.
Otherswise looks good. I'm glad the R5 is running so well for you.
10-25-14, 09:42 PM
#72
Ive tweaked the secondaries to be semi mechanical. More or less they are still 100% vacuum, but I played with the throttle tabs to help force open the plates sooner. No sputter like on my old Sterling so for now Im leaving the jets alone. You do get a big jolt of power when you nudge them open. For having maybe 120 horsepower the car feels very spry.
Phase 2 will be 15x7 wheels (Maybe Rota RBs like on my old SA), 2GDFIS or whatever the newest version is, sway bars, strut bar, stainless lines, window tint, 3 piece spoiler.
Phase 3 will be to rebuild and mild port my SE 13b. Most likely I will adapt the EFI into the SA chasis. I plan on running a full RB street port exhaust. I will consider a lightweight flywheel with this build in the future.
Phase 2 will be 15x7 wheels (Maybe Rota RBs like on my old SA), 2GDFIS or whatever the newest version is, sway bars, strut bar, stainless lines, window tint, 3 piece spoiler.
Phase 3 will be to rebuild and mild port my SE 13b. Most likely I will adapt the EFI into the SA chasis. I plan on running a full RB street port exhaust. I will consider a lightweight flywheel with this build in the future.
10-26-14, 02:19 AM
#73
Your Sterling used to sputter? That's not good. If you still have it, maybe you could combine both carbs in some way to make a hybrid.
Don't bother with 2GCDFIS. It never worked all that well and burns out ignitors really fast. Just do DLIDFIS or if you're into the big red box, get an MSD.
I'd go for the light steel and RB long primary now. Don't wait.
Also don't bother with EFI into the SA chassis, unless you're pretty sick of the 12A and need to add all the ugly manifolding to your otherwise pristine engine bay. I put an S4 ECU and 6 port into an 84-85 chassis and it's so-so power wise with the RB long primary and an 8 pound old school greddy flywheel (it drives like an RB aluminum flywheel as those are 7.5 pounds). This car previously had a stockport 12A similar to yours, actually, with a 30 pound SA flywheel (it had an 81-82 assembly) and the old short collected exhaust, stock stripped Nikki etc were all very similar to your current setup. The owner could lay the pedal down, wait for a bit, check his watch, then realize he doesn't wear a watch, look at the tach, oh it's only 3 grand so far, grab his smart phone to check the time, glance up at the road, back down at the tach, only 5k so far, look out and enjoy the scenery, open the vacuum secondaries, look back at the road for a bit, then back down at the tach, and eventually realize this is taking too long and finally decide to shift. See, he was used to driving a turbo FB so the stock 12A just wasn't cutting it. So for him, it made sense to do a 13B EFI swap. Plus the 84-85 chassis already has a nice hole for the ECU wires to go through and a bracket under the carpet that fits the ECU perfectly. The SA doesn't. Oh well, if you like a challenge, be my guest.
Don't bother with 2GCDFIS. It never worked all that well and burns out ignitors really fast. Just do DLIDFIS or if you're into the big red box, get an MSD.
I'd go for the light steel and RB long primary now. Don't wait.
Also don't bother with EFI into the SA chassis, unless you're pretty sick of the 12A and need to add all the ugly manifolding to your otherwise pristine engine bay. I put an S4 ECU and 6 port into an 84-85 chassis and it's so-so power wise with the RB long primary and an 8 pound old school greddy flywheel (it drives like an RB aluminum flywheel as those are 7.5 pounds). This car previously had a stockport 12A similar to yours, actually, with a 30 pound SA flywheel (it had an 81-82 assembly) and the old short collected exhaust, stock stripped Nikki etc were all very similar to your current setup. The owner could lay the pedal down, wait for a bit, check his watch, then realize he doesn't wear a watch, look at the tach, oh it's only 3 grand so far, grab his smart phone to check the time, glance up at the road, back down at the tach, only 5k so far, look out and enjoy the scenery, open the vacuum secondaries, look back at the road for a bit, then back down at the tach, and eventually realize this is taking too long and finally decide to shift. See, he was used to driving a turbo FB so the stock 12A just wasn't cutting it. So for him, it made sense to do a 13B EFI swap. Plus the 84-85 chassis already has a nice hole for the ECU wires to go through and a bracket under the carpet that fits the ECU perfectly. The SA doesn't. Oh well, if you like a challenge, be my guest.
10-26-14, 02:32 AM
#74
If you're still interested even after all that, please check out this thread somebody did a few years ago for even more discouragement. https://www.rx7club.com/1st-generati...roject-832622/
I gotta tell you, if I had seen this thread earlier this year before I considered swapping the EFI into the 84-85 chassis, I probably would not have bothered. The way the guy did the work is a real turn off. Fortunately I hadn't seen it, and my project turned out well and the owner is satisfied with it. It wasn't easy, though, but it did turn out way nicer than in that thread. Actually less complicated, too.
Was it worth it in the end? Yes because it was an 84-85 chassis, and the owner likes EFI, and I had the parts lying around, so yes. But do you want to know the ironic part? I too have an 84-85 chassis, however mine started life as a GSL-SE. But mine has a 4 port R5 13B with a Nikki on it. I'm statisfied.
I gotta tell you, if I had seen this thread earlier this year before I considered swapping the EFI into the 84-85 chassis, I probably would not have bothered. The way the guy did the work is a real turn off. Fortunately I hadn't seen it, and my project turned out well and the owner is satisfied with it. It wasn't easy, though, but it did turn out way nicer than in that thread. Actually less complicated, too.
Was it worth it in the end? Yes because it was an 84-85 chassis, and the owner likes EFI, and I had the parts lying around, so yes. But do you want to know the ironic part? I too have an 84-85 chassis, however mine started life as a GSL-SE. But mine has a 4 port R5 13B with a Nikki on it. I'm statisfied.
10-26-14, 09:25 AM
#75
I was concidering the EFI only due to reliability. If i decide to forego EFI plan B was to rebuild the SE keg as an R5 4 port, stock port, and adapt a Nikki to it. Unless i can find a deal on a 13b Holley. It would be an instant 30 horsepower gain swapping to 13b and 13b parts are easier to find in new condition. At the moment...