(STEERING) Steering issue: Not returning to center after turns.
06-19-09, 06:22 AM
#51
I thought about it possibly being the spool valve or the little torsion rod at the top of the steering box, but he swapped steering boxes. Chances are good that two boxes in a row wouldn't be bad. Besides, a bad spool valve would normally bias to one side or the other which would create a pull. He doesn't have a pull. This a returnability issue. I'm also pretty sure he has replaced the upper strut bearings if you look back at the first post. I say it has to be something really simple and stupid. One of those things that is really easy to overlook. If you can't find anything, then I'd take a look at the box. It is possible that the torsion bar in the top of the box that is suppose to return the spool valve to center is broken. Or it may just be adjusted too tight. Like I said before, I have to take a look at my notes. I'll do that tonight.
06-19-09, 12:37 PM
#52
Old [Sch|F]ool
As stated only those who are "Extremely" knowledgeable in this area are to offer suggestions please.
It's not very often that I am puzzled regarding any type of issue regarding our vehicles but I find my self in that position at the moment.
85 Gsl-Se with power steering-
On going issue with the steering when you make a left or right turn. If I make a right turn then proceed straight the car wants to pull right and also when making left turns it does the same wanting to pull left.
It's not very often that I am puzzled regarding any type of issue regarding our vehicles but I find my self in that position at the moment.
85 Gsl-Se with power steering-
On going issue with the steering when you make a left or right turn. If I make a right turn then proceed straight the car wants to pull right and also when making left turns it does the same wanting to pull left.
Same goes for the idler arm - it may be binding.
Are you sure the idler arm is installed properly - not off-axis? We're talking really thin likelihood here.
Is the steering box overtight?
As a rule, with the front tires off of the ground, you should be able to take the steering from full lock, and give the steering wheel one good yank and it should carry itself all the way to the other stop. If not, find the bind!
06-20-09, 11:07 PM
#55
Issue resolved.
After going over this in my head over and over and discussing it with a buddy of mine that we both have been around and worked on cars our whole lives. I decided to do what I normally do and that is go back to the beginning.
To look at what I had replaced since this had happened.
I put the car up in the air and up on jack stands then started looking for anything that would be loose or binding in the steering again. No noticeable binding or loose components.
I decided to check the strut plates again and this time I grabbed the strut piston while I was on the left side and shook it back and forth, no play. Went over to the right side and did the same thing and had play in the strut.
I disassemble the right side and removed the strut housing. I could grab the strut by the piston and move it around. So I disassembled the strut and removed it then reassemble it making sure that the spacer washer and nut seated correctly and tightened it back up. You could still move the strut around. I took my spare strut housing and put the same strut, spacer washer and securing nut with that housing, tightened it up and no movement of the strut. I put it back in the other one and again there was slop. I examined the inside bottom of the strut housing thinking that there was something that was preventing the base of the strut to mate with the inside bottom of the assembly and there was not. So I put the strut back in the other housing, reassembled the car and test drove. The issue is gone. Something going on with that strut housing not allowing the strut to seat and lock properly.
Never updated this as to the real cause of the issue-
When i had removed the struts to replace them with the Tokico's i did not pay attention to the location of the large washers. I looked at the FSM and they did not show how they fit into the assembly process so i called Tokico and asked them. I told them how where i had put them and they told me that it was correct. However it was not. I had the washers located on top of the stem of the strut and they actually belonged under the upper coil perch and the bearing plate. What this was causing was a binding between they coil perch and the strut plate. :-0
After going over this in my head over and over and discussing it with a buddy of mine that we both have been around and worked on cars our whole lives. I decided to do what I normally do and that is go back to the beginning.
To look at what I had replaced since this had happened.
I put the car up in the air and up on jack stands then started looking for anything that would be loose or binding in the steering again. No noticeable binding or loose components.
I decided to check the strut plates again and this time I grabbed the strut piston while I was on the left side and shook it back and forth, no play. Went over to the right side and did the same thing and had play in the strut.
I disassemble the right side and removed the strut housing. I could grab the strut by the piston and move it around. So I disassembled the strut and removed it then reassemble it making sure that the spacer washer and nut seated correctly and tightened it back up. You could still move the strut around. I took my spare strut housing and put the same strut, spacer washer and securing nut with that housing, tightened it up and no movement of the strut. I put it back in the other one and again there was slop. I examined the inside bottom of the strut housing thinking that there was something that was preventing the base of the strut to mate with the inside bottom of the assembly and there was not. So I put the strut back in the other housing, reassembled the car and test drove. The issue is gone. Something going on with that strut housing not allowing the strut to seat and lock properly.
Never updated this as to the real cause of the issue-
When i had removed the struts to replace them with the Tokico's i did not pay attention to the location of the large washers. I looked at the FSM and they did not show how they fit into the assembly process so i called Tokico and asked them. I told them how where i had put them and they told me that it was correct. However it was not. I had the washers located on top of the stem of the strut and they actually belonged under the upper coil perch and the bearing plate. What this was causing was a binding between they coil perch and the strut plate. :-0
Last edited by Rx-7Doctor; 11-04-09 at 03:50 PM.
06-21-09, 07:04 AM
#60
Congrats Doc! That was a tough one. But surely we must have contriubuted something to your thinking on this. If not, you should learn to be a better listener!
"position of the strut tower mounts..yeah, Im referring to the arrow" post #3
"Might be an offset issue coupled with not enough caster, or just a caster issue" post #5
"I'm a little suspicious of those "upgrade" Illumina's" post #20
"Good call guys on the Caster issue" post #27
'What'd you do to that thing anyway Doc to get the caster wacked out?" post #38
"The condition you are talking about sounds alot like Power steer pull or "self steer" post #50
And thanks also for being merciful in your deletions, some of this information may be useful to someone someday, this post helped some of us who learn a few more things about suspension details.
Glad you got it fixed!
"position of the strut tower mounts..yeah, Im referring to the arrow" post #3
"Might be an offset issue coupled with not enough caster, or just a caster issue" post #5
"I'm a little suspicious of those "upgrade" Illumina's" post #20
"Good call guys on the Caster issue" post #27
'What'd you do to that thing anyway Doc to get the caster wacked out?" post #38
"The condition you are talking about sounds alot like Power steer pull or "self steer" post #50
And thanks also for being merciful in your deletions, some of this information may be useful to someone someday, this post helped some of us who learn a few more things about suspension details.
Glad you got it fixed!
06-21-09, 03:17 PM
#63
Lets see if I can address each one of this Ray.
Yes members did contribute to this thread.
I stated the vehicle had been aligned therefore the position of the arrow on the strut tower mounts is irrelevant as I did not just replace the struts and then not have the alignment not performed. I had the alignment performed originally as I was having issues of a different sort and replaced ball joints, strut bushing, and other items. In this case it would not matter as I do not disturb the strut mounts when I replaced struts. I simply removed the nut that retains the strut and dropped the housing down. (this is also a tip for those that replace their struts and do not wish to disturb the current alignment specs).
Offset issue with not enough caster. I would have to say that I listened because as soon as I saw the post about that I went looking for my Alignment sheet specs and found that it was way off on the caster and rescheduled the alignment. I had figured that it would of been fixed after the caster was corrected but as stated it was not.
What did I do to get the caster way out of whack? Well I originally replaced the strut rod bushings but the caster should have been put back in specs by the alignment shop. Stated in post 27
Suspicious of Illumina's. Had nothing to do with anything as the Illumina's fit the other side strut housing and the spare strut housing and have the same base as the Tokico blues which fit the other housings. Also the fact that a stock strut has slop in the same strut housing that the Illumina had slop in. I had originally changed out this strut housing after the 1st alignment as the they were having trouble getting the camber in specs on the right side and I had already replaced all of the components and figured perhaps I had a bent spindle on the housing or a bent housing which was not the case. Because this all occurred 6 months ago I could not remember if the issue (failure to return to track) was there with the first strut housing.
Condition sounds like power steer or self steer. P/S had nothing to do with this.
So Ray as you can see I listened very well or I would not have posted a thread requesting input.
This was just a case of a very odd issue and a perhaps a tip to all when diagnosing to, "Go outside the box" when troubleshooting yet return to the basics of, "Remember" what was changed before this occured. All in all a very frustrating yet rewarding experience as with the help of my fellow rotor heads and a very close friend of mine that I was able to put my thinking cap back on and resolve a very perplexing issue.
Yes members did contribute to this thread.
I stated the vehicle had been aligned therefore the position of the arrow on the strut tower mounts is irrelevant as I did not just replace the struts and then not have the alignment not performed. I had the alignment performed originally as I was having issues of a different sort and replaced ball joints, strut bushing, and other items. In this case it would not matter as I do not disturb the strut mounts when I replaced struts. I simply removed the nut that retains the strut and dropped the housing down.
(this is also a tip for those that replace their struts and do not wish to disturb the current alignment specs). Offset issue with not enough caster. I would have to say that I listened because as soon as I saw the post about that I went looking for my Alignment sheet specs and found that it was way off on the caster and rescheduled the alignment. I had figured that it would of been fixed after the caster was corrected but as stated it was not.
What did I do to get the caster way out of whack? Well I originally replaced the strut rod bushings but the caster should have been put back in specs by the alignment shop. Stated in post 27
Suspicious of Illumina's. Had nothing to do with anything as the Illumina's fit the other side strut housing and the spare strut housing and have the same base as the Tokico blues which fit the other housings. Also the fact that a stock strut has slop in the same strut housing that the Illumina had slop in.
I had originally changed out this strut housing after the 1st alignment as the they were having trouble getting the camber in specs on the right side and I had already replaced all of the components and figured perhaps I had a bent spindle on the housing or a bent housing which was not the case. Because this all occurred 6 months ago I could not remember if the issue (failure to return to track) was there with the first strut housing. Condition sounds like power steer or self steer. P/S had nothing to do with this.
So Ray as you can see I listened very well or I would not have posted a thread requesting input.
This was just a case of a very odd issue and a perhaps a tip to all when diagnosing to, "Go outside the box" when troubleshooting yet return to the basics of, "Remember" what was changed before this occured. All in all a very frustrating yet rewarding experience as with the help of my fellow rotor heads and a very close friend of mine that I was able to put my thinking cap back on and resolve a very perplexing issue.
Congrats Doc! That was a tough one. But surely we must have contriubuted something to your thinking on this. If not, you should learn to be a better listener!
"position of the strut tower mounts..yeah, Im referring to the arrow" post #3
"Might be an offset issue coupled with not enough caster, or just a caster issue" post #5
"I'm a little suspicious of those "upgrade" Illumina's" post #20
"Good call guys on the Caster issue" post #27
'What'd you do to that thing anyway Doc to get the caster wacked out?" post #38
"The condition you are talking about sounds alot like Power steer pull or "self steer" post #50
And thanks also for being merciful in your deletions, some of this information may be useful to someone someday, this post helped some of us who learn a few more things about suspension details.
Glad you got it fixed!
"position of the strut tower mounts..yeah, Im referring to the arrow" post #3
"Might be an offset issue coupled with not enough caster, or just a caster issue" post #5
"I'm a little suspicious of those "upgrade" Illumina's" post #20
"Good call guys on the Caster issue" post #27
'What'd you do to that thing anyway Doc to get the caster wacked out?" post #38
"The condition you are talking about sounds alot like Power steer pull or "self steer" post #50
And thanks also for being merciful in your deletions, some of this information may be useful to someone someday, this post helped some of us who learn a few more things about suspension details.
Glad you got it fixed!
Last edited by Rx-7Doctor; 06-21-09 at 03:27 PM.
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